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This week, Erin sits down with her friend of over 20 years, Janene, someone she met as a young mom, and reconnected with after both of their divorces. They've built a friendship on disagreeing without breaking, and this episode is exactly that in action. Janene grew up Mormon in Utah County, and what she remembers most isn't church on Sundays — it was survival, image, and learning early that her value was tied to how she looked. Erin and Janene trace the through line from being teenagers with zero real conversations about sex, to marriages that fell apart in very different ways, to a second marriage for Janene that landed her in a one-stoplight town where she was labeled a Jezebel before anyone gave her a chance. But the conversation goes deeper, too. They get into the pattern they both keep circling back to: how, over and over, when a man in their life messed up, the blame somehow found its way back to them. Erin tells a deeply personal story she's never told Janene before. Janene opens up about how pressure, guilt, and a desire pulled her toward experiences — including swinging — that she now recognizes she didn't actually want. This episode includes:
- How Erin and Janene met at work over 20 years ago, and how they found their way back to each other post-divorce
- Growing up Mormon in Utah County vs. being Mormon-adjacent — and why that distinction actually matters
- The embarrassing bishop's office story Erin has never told Janene before
- Janene's experience at 16 that taught her exactly how shame gets assigned in these communities
- What it felt like to move into a small town as a divorced mom and be treated like an outcast
- The real reason Janene believes pornography played a role in her marriage
- How "no" turned into pressure, turned into a threesome, turned into swinging
- Erin and Janene's genuinely different takes on porn — and why they can disagree without it becoming a fight
Erin and Janene don't wrap this one up with a bow — there's too much left to say, and they both know it. What they land on instead is the thing that's held their friendship together for two decades: telling the truth, even when it's messy, even when it doesn't make you look good.
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